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Star Trek Alpha Discussion

posted Nov 24, 2016 18:24:53 by ChrisBirch
Please discuss the first Alpha release here
[Last edited Oct 10, 2017 23:52:16]
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817 replies
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jobenson74@gmail.com said Jan 13, 2017 15:21:24
For the devolution once a player was infected (Newman, Sevek & Martinez originally) every time they rolled a complication it increased there complication range by one. So once the first 20 was rolled, it would go to 19-20, and so on. I explained when they got to 15-20 complication range they would be devolved like the Neanderthals, and it was all over. Martinez got to 16.


What a great idea! I'm going to run the test scenario for a third time later this week and I'm going to "infect" all the crewmembers with the de-evolution. That way, they are racing against time and increasing debilitation to complete their tasks. It will add an exciting element, I think, that the scenario is lacking and give them real motivation for finding a cure.

I'd also like to include a few devolved scientists of species other than human. What would a devolved Tellarite or Andorian look like? How about adding a devolved Klingon for some real menace?
[Last edited Jan 13, 2017 15:23:25]
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DavidRosson said Jan 13, 2017 20:53:50
"if all the Progress has been marked off before the Task was attempted," not sure how this can happen.

It was marked it off thanks to the result of previous rolls in the extended task. Note in case it is not clear: Completing progress does not complete the task in the current version of the rules, only completing breakthroughs equal to the magnitude.

Stun - No rules for Stun as per the Neanderthal attacks at the start of the adventure

p30 "If the Attack or hazard that inflicted the Injury was intended to Stun, then the Injury is recovered automatically at the end of the scene: the character regains consciousness without difficulty, though they may be in an awkward situation if the enemy managed to capture them in the process."

It was also noted at this point that Phasers did not have a stun setting - This seemed a massive oversight.

p29 "The character should also declare whether the attack is intended to Stun or to Kill, though some weapons may not allow this choice."

The 4 difficulty is a high requirement and the progress track is very high ... however the [CD] dice mostly rolled 3/4

Did your players spend Determination or take advantage of the following two momentum spends? It can be a huge help, especially the reroll vs 3/4 on CDs.
p15 "When rolling [CD] against an Extended Task, the character may spend one Momentum (Repeatable) to add +1 to the total rolled ... Alternately, a character may spend one Momentum to reroll any number of [CD] rolled."

Phasers should be an “I Win” weapon really if they hit. In the shows/film a lot of the time they miss, so perhaps something to emulate that would work better.

Apparently clearer in other 2d20 games, that is what Stress is supposed to be: An abstract reflection of dodging, ducking, near misses, and light grazes. Basically only a non-stun actual Injury is a real wound and everything else is just fatigue and luck depletion. So unless the phaser attack scores 5 Stress or depletes Stress altogether you should describe it to the players as some sort of miss or glancing shot.
[Last edited Jan 13, 2017 20:55:10]
"It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid." - Q
Star Trek RPG Files (Character Build Reference and Constellation Class Starship)
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LibrariaNPC said Jan 14, 2017 16:55:59
For the devolution once a player was infected (Newman, Sevek & Martinez originally) every time they rolled a complication it increased there complication range by one. So once the first 20 was rolled, it would go to 19-20, and so on. I explained when they got to 15-20 complication range they would be devolved like the Neanderthals, and it was all over. Martinez got to 16.


I have an online group I'll be trying this out on, as well as an in-person group this weekend (if I get enough players). I think this is MUCH more interesting than mandating the roll for being out for too long.

That said, I think I would have it kick in as they are working with the Poisonous Plants or at the Science Station (if they used Momentum to get there).
"Smilies exist because no one's bothered to make a sarcasm font." Lost_Heretic
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Sam Byford said Jan 15, 2017 10:30:23
Do we have any idea when the next phase is going to be rolled out? My group are chomping at the bit to play again!
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T Pe said Jan 15, 2017 18:29:59
I ran the game for 6 seasoned gamer's and we had a couple issues. First of all, and the biggest, was having two different economies that influenced the dice i.e. determination and momentum. We all agreed that only one was really necessary. Also, we agreed the rules for the use of momentum and more so to its two classifications of Immediate or Repeatable was a bit confusing. We house ruled the definitions after some debate as we couldn't figure out what the rules dictated 100%. The only real question we have is what is the purpose of having momentum being classified as either Immediate and/or Repeatable? Maybe the answer was right in front of our faces, but we where unable to make a clear determination based on the rules given. I have to apologize I wasn't able to read through all of the forum yet and sorry if this was asked and answered.
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jobenson74@gmail.com said Jan 15, 2017 19:09:00
I ran the game for 6 seasoned gamer's and we had a couple issues. First of all, and the biggest, was having two different economies that influenced the dice i.e. determination and momentum. We all agreed that only one was really necessary. Also, we agreed the rules for the use of momentum and more so to its two classifications of Immediate or Repeatable was a bit confusing. We house ruled the definitions after some debate as we couldn't figure out what the rules dictated 100%. The only real question we have is what is the purpose of having momentum being classified as either Immediate and/or Repeatable? Maybe the answer was right in front of our faces, but we where unable to make a clear determination based on the rules given. I have to apologize I wasn't able to read through all of the forum yet and sorry if this was asked and answered.


I've gotten to the point where I will allow the use of momentum if the use seemed reasonable. There are too many fiddly uses and it became cumbersome to the game to continuously consult the rules to see if the requested use was allowed. It made the game flow faster, anyway.

The first time I ran the game, I adhered to the rules regarding extended tasks to the letter and the game really dragged down and became a boring roll-fest. The second time, I made the task much more free-form and allowed the players more input and control. It seemed more organic and was certainly more fun for the players. They didn't know they were doing an extended task, but that they had a series of obstacles to overcome to accomplish their goal. It was a more successful event in the game because I hid the rules from the players.
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Nathan.Dowdell said Jan 15, 2017 19:57:33
I ran the game for 6 seasoned gamer's and we had a couple issues. First of all, and the biggest, was having two different economies that influenced the dice i.e. determination and momentum. We all agreed that only one was really necessary. Also, we agreed the rules for the use of momentum and more so to its two classifications of Immediate or Repeatable was a bit confusing. We house ruled the definitions after some debate as we couldn't figure out what the rules dictated 100%. The only real question we have is what is the purpose of having momentum being classified as either Immediate and/or Repeatable? Maybe the answer was right in front of our faces, but we where unable to make a clear determination based on the rules given. I have to apologize I wasn't able to read through all of the forum yet and sorry if this was asked and answered.

In short, past experience with other uses of the 2D20 System has shown the necessity of these classifications. Knowing when particular spends can be used, and whether or not a spend can be used multiple times, is useful, and reducing those things down to single-word notation keeps from having to explain it in full every time.

By default, Momentum can only be used when resolving a successful Task, and each spend can only be used once per Task (or once per round in combat and similar circumstances). Immediate and Repeatable signify when a particular Momentum spend breaks one or other of those conditions:

Immediate spends can be used at times other than following a successful Task (though most have their own specific conditions on when they can be used), by spending directly from the group pool. They also tie into the Threat side of the mechanics - you can pay for an Immediate Momentum spend by adding to Threat instead of spending Momentum. Immediate is used for anything you spend Momentum on that isn't done as part of a successful Task, such as bonus d20s, increasing enemy Task difficulty, taking extra Minor Actions in combat, and Keeping the Initiative in combat. Any Momentum spend that isn't Immediate can only be used when resolving a successful Task.

Repeatable spends can be used as many times as you like within a given Task or circumstance. This is normally where the spend grants a numerical bonus (like extra damage from an attack).

The confusion tends to occur because, in spite of Momentum working this way by default, the most ubiquitous Momentum spend is buying extra d20s, which is both Immediate and Repeatable (that is, you can use it outside of a successful Task, and you can use it multiple times), which tends to impact how people perceive it. I'm looking into this, but as it's largely a perceptual issue (it concerns how the rules are presented more than how they work), it's a tricky one to solve.
Game Development - 2D20 System
System Design - Star Trek Adventures

Rules questions and playtest feedback to nathan@modiphius.com
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DavidRosson said Jan 15, 2017 21:50:16
determination and momentum. We all agreed that only one was really necessary.


I can see the distinction myself. Momentum is a dice success (roll play) reward that mostly adds bonuses without dictating results. Determination is a participation (role play) reward that directly edits the universe (guaranteeing success, granting an extra action, inserting a plot point, ignoring an injury).

I used to play a lot of World of Darkness so having a bazillion different economies (temp Willpower, perm Willpower, multiple supernatural traits, etc) that have a lot of overlap is sort of second nature. :)
"It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid." - Q
Star Trek RPG Files (Character Build Reference and Constellation Class Starship)
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T Pe said Jan 15, 2017 23:28:31
The confusion tends to occur because, in spite of Momentum...


A few examples of how you want that to be spent properly would be very helpful to include in the rules. The examples for other rules where very helpful in determining how the other mechanics worked. Also, can determination be spent on a Task that already
has a momentum spend on it?

I adhered to the rules regarding extended tasks to the letter and the game really dragged down and became a boring roll-fest


We had that same feeling with the extended tasks. It felt like alright everyone lets throw numbers at the problem to make it go away. Despite myself trying to add alot of narration and tech-babble into the scene.

I used to play a lot of World of Darkness so having a bazillion different economies (temp Willpower, perm Willpower, multiple supernatural traits, etc) that have a lot of overlap is sort of second nature. :)


We agree to an extent and diddo btw, but with game systems like Fate and others out and about. We feel like the single increase mechanic would be better then having two. If they are going to keep determination then get rid of all dice changing functions that it currently has and just make it a narrative one. People in my game where trying to test the system and finding ways too creatively use determination on a die roll while triggering a value at the same time. I felt like who am I to put the brakes on the good idea train and in turn they where role-playing their PC. Not a deal breaker for how the system is set up at the moment just more of a preference thing.
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Nathan.Dowdell said Jan 15, 2017 23:38:21
Also, can determination be spent on a Task that already has a momentum spend on it?

Yes. The only limit is that no more than three additional d20s can be bought for a Task, regardless of how they're obtained.
Game Development - 2D20 System
System Design - Star Trek Adventures

Rules questions and playtest feedback to nathan@modiphius.com
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Elbert Smith said Jan 16, 2017 04:26:44
I ran another adventure with my players today, this one was an adventure I came up with. This time was more focused on combat and social interactions that they where able to do well. We liked the effects in the dice rolling with damage but sometimes I felt they got out of situations to easy. Especially when they chose the area effect, being able to hurt more than one bad guy at a time. I left out an extended task for this adventure but will probably try and do one the next game since this is a two part adventure. I made their Ensigns part of a special squad who deals with trying to thwart a rising threat called the Triad. A group of freedom fighters who hate the Federation. We are just biding our time till we get our next play test info.
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AdamColeman said Jan 16, 2017 07:14:23
The only limit is that no more than three additional d20s can be bought for a Task, regardless of how they're obtained.


That's a good point actually, never thought that the Determination spend counted as am extra d20 for tgat restriction.

Might be worth making that clear in the rules, that or I missed where it said that that counted towards the three dice limit.
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DavidRosson said Jan 16, 2017 10:07:39
It could definitely be clearer but it would basically be a consequence of the second paragraph on p8 (which establishes the 5 normal methods and their 3 dice limit) and the subsequent paragraphs that then start detailing the methods (which includes determination just a little ways down that page). Probably that is also why the definition of the Determination spend went to the effort of being described as a d20 roll that is assumed to come up 1 rather then simply just saying you are buying two successes. Basically by defining it as a roll it becomes subject to other rules related to rolls.
[Last edited Jan 16, 2017 10:12:54]
"It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid." - Q
Star Trek RPG Files (Character Build Reference and Constellation Class Starship)
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jobenson74@gmail.com said Jan 16, 2017 18:33:47
The next playtest packet just dropped.
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Ian Kirby said Jan 17, 2017 19:35:28
Slight geeky nit-pick on the Lexington ship colour coding on the skills. Command/Con should be Yellow and Engineering/Security should be Red for the 23rd Century ship.
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