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Modiphius > Mutant Chronicles Playtest Discussion (CLOSED)

Beta 5.0 Discussion

posted Feb 28, 2014 18:04:32 by ChrisBirch
Please post comments based on the 5.0 playtest document here thanks!
[Last edited Feb 10, 2016 00:20:11]
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77 replies
Doc-T said Mar 04, 2014 22:51:14
Page 10:

When two or more characters are competing for success,
each character involved in the task performs a skill test.
The character who achieves the most successes wins the
opposed test. In the case of a tie, the character with the
higher expertise training in the tested skill wins.

Who wins, if the expertise training is the same for each character? Please give a complete algorithm to resolve ties.
Doc-T said Mar 05, 2014 16:00:22
For simplicity while playing I suggest to write down expertise in a skill on a character sheet not as a bonus (e.g., +2), which then needs to be added to the ability rating on the fly by the player rolling the dice, but instead write it as the number to beat (e.g., 12, if the attribute is 10 and the skill is +2). This requires less cognitive strain, though minor, while playing and being in a (positively) stressful situation aka enhances usability aka is better system ergonomics.
[Last edited Mar 05, 2014 16:00:50]
Doc-T said Mar 05, 2014 16:10:24
The rule on page 9 sais:

Each natural 20 is still resolved, regardless of how many successes are generated

However, contrary to this, the quick rule overview on the character sheet sais:

4. If roll 1 success
A 20 causes Complication
or 2 Dark Symmetry points.

Shouldn't that be:

"4. If roll 1 or more successes ..."
[Last edited Mar 05, 2014 16:11:27]
Doc-T said Mar 05, 2014 16:15:23
According to the quick rule overview on the character sheet, for a successful roll each 20 might generate 2 dark symmetry points, and for an unsuccessful roll a 20 also might generate 2 dark symmetry points.

Shouldn't the negative effect of complications of a failed roll worse than those of a successful one? Like, e.g., 1 DSP for each 20 on a success and 2 DSP for each 20 on a miss. ... or 2 DSP on a miss per difficulty rating or so...

Doc-T said Mar 05, 2014 16:35:17
Page 14 f.:

The rules allow to move up to (3 * Agility + 1) meters:
1. chain action movement for 1 * Agility meters, followed by
2. standard action sprint for another 2 * Agility meters, followed by
3. free action adjust stance for another 1 meter.

Right? If this is not intended, there is no rule to prevent it.
[Last edited Mar 05, 2014 16:55:30]
Doc-T said Mar 05, 2014 16:54:26
Page 17:

Cover provides Soak of 2d6 or 4d6. It is not stated in the rules if or if not the same interpretation of dice rolls as for damage rolls applies. There need to be either

"d6 rolls are handled the same as for damage."


"All values rolled on a d6 are applied."

An example could clarify, if rolling a 2 and a 4 on 2d6 results in a Soak of 2 or 6.
[Last edited Mar 05, 2014 16:54:54]
Doc-T said Mar 05, 2014 16:57:29
Page 17:

After an attack’s damage has been calculated – based
on a weapon’s damage rating, any bonus damage, and
Momentum – ...


After an attack’s damage has been calculated – based
on a weapon’s damage rating, any bonus damage, any
Momentum and any Soak from cover

Also, the example for Damage & Wounds does not explain, how Soak 1 of the robe and 2d6 Soak from cover does add up to a value of 2 Soak - the die roll is missing in the example.
[Last edited Mar 05, 2014 16:59:20]
Doc-T said Mar 05, 2014 17:20:03
Page 18:

What happens, if all critical wound markers are filled, and there is more damage to distribute?

A Critically Injured character acts last during a combat
round, after all player characters and GM controlled
characters have acted.

How is initiative determined if there are several Critically Injured characters? This should be explained.

A Staggered character cannot perform a Response Action
unless he spends one Chronicle point.

It is not clear, if this means,
a) a Chronicle point needs to be expended for each Response Action, (i.e., 1 CP per Response, but still Staggered) or
b) after spending a Chronicle points, Response Actions are possible again (i.e., 1 CP to no longer be Staggered).
This should be explained.

Also, "Staggered" is not a condition seen on the exemplary character sheets (New_Pre_Gens.pdf) This probably needs to be amended on the character sheet.

It should also made visibly clear on the character sheet, that being critically wounded AUTOMATICALLY means to be Staggered and Overwhelmed and X.

re: X... there is no special name for "acts last during combat round". Not knowing, what is coming regarding equipment and effects of the Dark Legion, but if this is an effect that needs to be attributed, than it should have a name, should be represented on the char sheet with an appropriate marker, and should be included in the above-mentioned visualization of being included in being Critically Injured. This should be harmonized in the rules and presentation.

When a character is Impaired, his critical failure range
increases by one, from 20 to 19-20.

Sooooo, if a character is Overwhelmed, the critical failure range is 18-20. When a character is also Impaired, is the new failure range now
a) 17-20, because being Impaired means "his critical failure range is increased by one", or is it
b) still 18-20, because being "Overwhelmed is a more severe condition than Impaired" only the worse condition is relevant?
This needs to be clarified.

Visually, I feel, that because "Overwhelmed is a more severe condition than Impaired" Impaired should be above Overwhelmed on the character sheet, so that Overwhelmed follows Impaired top-to-bottom as a natural way of "continuing further down the spiral"
[Last edited Mar 05, 2014 17:36:29]
Doc-T said Mar 05, 2014 17:35:26
Page 19:

Again, visualization of "Seriously Injured". As it includes being "Impaired", I feel this should be made visually more clear.

Perhaps it is feasible to have the "Impaired" box below the tick marks for serious wounds, and the Staggered, Overwhelmed, X-from-comment-above below the critical wounds markers.

When a character is Impaired, his
critical failure range increases by
one, from 20 to 19-20.

This has already been stated one page up at "Impaired".

Honestly, I am a bit confused, which effect follows which injury type. I suggest a more clear structure, perhaps first list the various effects, and then state the injury levels and which effects they include - or vice versa. But as it is written now, mixing injury status with effects reads confusing.

wake someone who has been
knocked unconscious.

Oops! "unconscious"? What status effect or injury type is this? How did we get here? What did I miss?

First Aid explanations do not clarify, how First Aid applies to Light Wounds of different hit locations. Does
a) one successful First Aid role with momentum allow to heal Light Wounds at different hit locations, or
b) does each hit location with light wounds require a separate First Aid test and overflowing Momentum is lost?

The "Empathic Healer" ability of 'Angel' Kramer of New_Pre_Gens.pdf suggest solution b), but this should be explained more clearly in the rules.
Doc-T said Mar 05, 2014 17:42:42
Page 20:

"Parry tests" - is Parry a skill? I don't see it on any pregen character. Or is it a Response action with close combat - Dodge is in there!? This should be explained somewhere, but I guess, the combat rules will receive more explicitness in the final rules?

Several times "increase the difficulty ... by two steps." I read Cortex in here :-) There is no "step" defined in the MC3 rules, instead, there is DR (difficulty rating). I suspect "step" is a remnant of old rule versions. Shouldn't all these occurences be altered to "increase the Difficulty Rating ... by 2."?

I suggest to rewrite "It can affect a target 100 kg larger for each additional Momentum spent." to a more legible "For each additional Momentum spent, the target mass limit can be increased by 100 kg."

There were no "armour Soak values" so far, only "hit location Soak values". Perhaps armour should be introduced beforehand.

When a weapon with the Stun trait hits a target in the head," ... I see the limitation to the head viable for a manual stun baton, but for e-stunners, stun guns, stun rays, anti-riot stun nets, yadda yadda. I think this very limiting. Shouldn't this rather apply to any hit location, and be limited in the equipment case-by-case?

Ranged weapons without the Burstfire trait lose an Ammo
Load when a critical failure is rolled. The character must spend
an action reloading before they can use the weapon again.

Really? Not "Ranged weapons without the Burstfire trait lose an Ammo Load when a critical failure is rolled. If no Ammo Load remains, the character must spend an action reloading before they can use the weapon again." Else having more than one Ammo Load capacity on a weapon does not make sense, because the rule sais, after losing "an" Ammo Load, the weapon needs to be reloaded, not "all" Ammo Loads.

Also, "an action reloading" is not defined in the action rules before. However, there is the "Chain Action" called "Reload".

Also, how many Ammo Loads does reloading reload? All? One? Or? This actually refers back to page 15: "the character can use this action to clear the jam or reload" is interesting fluff, but does not relate to the "Ammo Load" term used later.

This reloading stuff is actually mentioned twice in two consecutive paragraphs, this needs a clearup.

I feel, different parts of the rules do not reference each other well. I suggest to harmonize the wording in the rules better and make consequent use of the defined terms.
[Last edited Mar 05, 2014 18:11:00]
JoshuaKlug said Mar 06, 2014 00:45:38
Re: Opposed Skill Test ties.

Beta 5 rules finishes the algorithm: "If it is still a tie during a combat encounter, the action continues into the next round where a new skill test will be made. Outside of combat, the two characters perform another skill test."

Just got missed/omitted from the open beta rules.
KingYnnen said Mar 06, 2014 13:36:01
You guys are doing a great job citing clarity issues in the open Beta / adventure.

We had to significantly abridge the rules to reach a particular page limit goal. Some of these inconsistencies are a result of that abridgment, but in other places it seems we cut back too much at the cost of clarity.

I am going through my Beta working documents and making sure these questions and issues are addressed in the full Beta rules for distribution after more people have read through and commented on the Beta adventure and v05 Beta document. Changes from one version to the next are flagged for easy reference to ensure the proper information makes it to the proper places.

Keep up the great feedback!

- Jay

If life is a game... I need new dice.
Doc-T said Mar 06, 2014 17:51:09
Thanks for the encouraging feedback on the feedback :-)

I don't have much time&energy right now to continue clarity-reading, hopefully on the upcoming weekend...
FawaDarkblade said Mar 09, 2014 01:52:01
I like the idea of 2D20 system but dislike Expertise and Focus.

I propose to do so:

Expertise: I will rating from 1 to 5. Expertise ranks are added to the related attribute to indicate the target number at which a player will achieve a success and indicates a range within which a player generates additional successes when using the related skill.

Focus: Any character can get focus on any skill. Focus add 1D20 when character make a skill test with their focus skills, so rolls 3D20.
Chris Edwards said Mar 09, 2014 11:10:52
I am quite happy with the attribute being the major factor in skill tests but think skill ranks should also be important. I think the penalty on making an unskilled skill test should be increased.
I would go for either a +1D or considered impaired, on an unskilled general skill test
And either +2D or considered Overwhelmed or +1D and impaired, on an unskilled advanced skill test.
As an alternative to the above, use the current playtest rules for unskilled tests but add that a character can never gain Momentum from an unskilled skill check, can not spend Chronicle Points on the roll but can give the GM Dark Symmetry points for extra dice.

This keeps the Attribute as the major factor but makes skill ranks important to avoid the penalties on unskilled tests.
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